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Hi Anthony,

It has been a long time since I last posted. I would like to share a Ming jade Pi Hsieh from our collection.

This rare and important piece is made of khotan jade meausuring 6 1/2 inches. On its chest there is an inscription in Chinese translated as "made to The Imperial Order of Hung Wu".

Pictures are attached.

Best Regards,
Frank

Hi Frank

A number of these type of sinuous "jade" types were made in the Song, (copying western and Eastern Zhou types)but without the elaboration. I've not seen any others from the Yaun period.
There was in the 18th century a period when a number of this style were made when a Shang tomb came to light and an archaic style became the fashion in Imperial household.

I believe their would have been a companion piece which forms the other half of the eight legged lion, you will also note one of the tails is a split tail, that is the fur bearing fish. The other tail is there representing the makarra crocodile.

The piece has not quite got the essence of the archaic vessels. It's lost the head to tail aspect which was a very important part of archaic vessels.

The asymetrical curls are forming the Aum symbol.

The trio of the fur bearing fish , eight legged lion and makarra crocodile.

The phoenix is present, the type of tail seen on the phoenix is Shang in origin.

How to build a dragon. There should be in the design, creation symbol's of some form.

Note the use of a long que. Long que's were not either in fashion or enforced upon the population during the Ming, but were during the Ching.

Interesting piece. A typical piece that uses previous styles and animal motif's from pre-Buddhist proto Chinese art to form a later Buddhist piece.

I have a Tibetan conch with the exact same mythical animals present.

The Hung Wu is probably a respect mark. Although it cannot be discounted as of the period it is marked.

Does the head of the animal have any stylised horns. This piece of your's is also related to the dragon jade in my collection. Same mythology.

Any sign's of pigment on the piece.

Nick

Nice interesting piece. Thanks for sharing it with us. This piece is the very essence of Chinese imperial sacrificial art.
Looks like a creation symbol being formed on the rear middle underside.

Could you provide a photo of this detail please.

What you are calling a bi hsieh, I believe in their original context of the western zhou were the hu of the object from the Book of Rites which form one of the six articles of auspicious tokens. Circular Bi, ts'ung (Cong), kuei, chang, hu and huang.

The hu was used to worship the West and was emblematic of the tiger constellation ruling over the Yin part of the year as the the Dragon rules over the Yang part of the year and Eastern sky. The hu also had the tao-tie mask engraved upon it.

Because I can't see the full piece i can't work out the full iconograhy as I have to start counting all the different elements.

Have fun

Dear Anonymous of Fine Art,

Is this piece a recent fake as well?

Frank

Hi Frank- I have been doing some research on your Ming jade Pi Hsieh. It is a rarity for any artifact bearing the name of Hung Wu'. Any porcelain or artifact bearing the nien hao of either, Hung Wu' or the Yongle emperor is highly suspect.

When the nien hao is used, it would read: Great Ming Hung Wu' period made. But the phrasing of the Imperial court during the infant stages of the Ming, would read: "made to The Imperial Order of Hung Wu".

There is a large temple bell in China ascribed to the Yongle emperor using this type phrase. So what I am saying, is that the phrasing is correct for the early period of the Ming dynasty.

Your jade example also has the standard features typical for the style and period; the piece was carved using the under cut technique, a cutting away of the material to create a protruded effect. Also typical for the period, the Ming dynasty used jades that had a variety of color and utilized the inclusions in the decorative process to achieve the maximum effect.

This artifact will be difficult to prove, but knowing your luck... No Problem. :)

Ed

Hi Ed,

You are absolutely correct to say Hung Wu or Yongle mark is extremely rare almost non existence. I did explain to you the reason for having the inscriptions that say "made to The Imperial Order of Hung Wu" when we talked in private about this piece.

There is another important point to note about this Pi Hsieh is that it has five claws. I have seen many Pi Hsieh over the past 35 years or so but this is the first time I come across one that has five claws. This further confirms my opinion that it is an Imperial piece.

Furthemore the quality of the material used is extremely high i.e. Khotan nephrite.

Best Regards,
Frank

I have today tried to improve my camera skill and took some better pictures of this rare and important piece as I have received many messages in private asking me for better pictues.

Frank

Ed, I don't agree with you when you said pieces with Hung Wu or Yongle marks are treated with suspect. If you have been following "new finds" in China over the past decade or so you will be very surprised to see that there are so many new discoveries which many people never dream to believe they even existed say 25 years ago.

Frank

Hi,Frank

This is a recent fake. I am sorry but this is the case. Stop importing!

Dear Anonymous,

I love it.

Frank

Hi Frank- You're correct to say that new discoveries are made in China: what was once a myth in many cases are now being validated through the ancient Chinese history text. I should have stated that the nien hao of Hung Wu or Yongle are treated suspect in the West, at least as far as porcelain is concerned.

My response to Fine Art in general would be, that Frank does not import, but rather goes to the source... I can almost smell the old Ming and Qing tombs. So Frank what advice would you give to the armchair dealer and collector?

Ed

Hi Frank

I am sorry if you think I am wrong. I do not know where and how you get the jade. There are whole a lot of that kind of stuff in every antique market in China. I simly want to warn your of the risk of buying fake item. If you knows for sure that it is old, that is fine.

:)

Fine Art

Ed, You're correct I don't import as I am living in China. I am not a dealer as well. I have been studying, researching and collecting for 40 years. Regarding advice to armchair collectors and dealers my lecture fee can be very expensive (smile).

Best Regards,
Frank Loo, Ph.D.

Hi Frank

The features of your kuei dragon are very similar to a bronze vase designed by the artist Emperor Xuande. the vase already appears on the forum.
In the next couple of days I will take a close up of the face of the Kuei in the vase and post it.
The vase contains the sacrificial inscription in the form of the bagua having been inscripted into the faces of the main dragon and the kuei.
The kuei reads (kuei), relationship wise second daughter/younger daughter.
The main dragon contains the bagua for fire and water. How appropriate for a reticulated tailed, winged dragon.

I can't determine from the photo's if your piece contain's an inscription. Teeth and eyes are the yielding lines, those lines that are used in the remainder of the facial features that go across the face, the strong.

You will see what I mean when I post the bronze vase, as i'll point them out.


Nick

Hi Nick,

Your observation is very interesting. I know the secrets of this piece from a Fung Shui perspective. I have been studying and researching Fung Shui for over 35 years. I will not discuss them in this forum as it is not the right place.

Frank

Ok Frank, geomancy played a very important part in Chinese culture (and still does).

I've already shown the Forum how it's done from the Jade mask of Niuheliang, among other items.

I need a favour Frank as you live in the Mother counrty.

I need to get hold of or access to

1. The Book of Rites
2. The Book of Marvels (if in existance)
3. The Veritable Records of Xuande, Kiang Hsi and Chien Long.
4. Unographie Chinoserie by Gustave Schlegel

Any idea's.


Schlegel dated the Chinese zodiac to 18000 years old in the above ref. I,m able to now confirm his dating. But I need to know what he means by the Jade of Stars from his original 19th century work.

An original Unographie costs 40000 Yen.

Schlegel also wrote on the Hung League, very interesting, and contains a wealth of info on Chinese numerology and the secrets.

Nick


Frank, is it still a practice in China to bury people with a pearl in the mouth?

Nick,

The last known record of putting a pearl in the mouth of the death was in the case of Emperess Dowager (Cixi) when she died on November 15,1908.

As reagrds the other matters, I would prefer we talk in private.

Frank

I don't knowif the book will be available in China, Wild Swans by Jung Chang records the use of the pearl at funerals during the period when Manchuko still had an Emperor Pu Yi until the mid fourties.

That's why I asked was it still common practice.

Abviously not any more

Cheers

Nick

can any one tell me anything about this piece.





URL Title :Virgin International

Hi Dr Frank Loo,

I find your discussion very interesting. Just joined the Forum recently with my "Request Assistance" posting.

I had a pair of Pi Hsieh, phto enclosed which I think might not be a recent replica. I noticed that the pair could be made from a single pice of rock cut diagonally into 2.

I found 2 dragons engraved on the top of both pieces. If they are not good pieces I apologize 'cos I don't have much knowlege, just simply picking things up based on feeling.

Thank You.

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