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I find it interesting that the favorite comeback to those who question the eBay-ite theorists is that they don't have any jade knowledge to back up their arguments against the Hongshan Lottery.

The eBay-ites like to post photos to challenge those in the forum who do have expertise, but what happens when the forum experts ignore the thread and don't rise to the bait?

And why don't they say where the bait photos came from?

And what do they switch to once the coast is clear?

Check out what the owner and seller of the piece of bait shown in this thread had to say about the second set of items which the eBay-ite theorist switched to and described as "the best and most authentic Hongshan piece from a site by one of my jade pals who has been collecting Hongshan jades for years and whose opinons I respect and value highly.":

The Full Thread:
http://www.asianart.com/phpforum/index.php?method=detailAll&Id=26403#27757

Quote- the owner and seller of the Bait item:

"Thank you Bill for posting here one picture from our website without our agreement:
http://www.pipane.com (first) This is indeed real Hong Shan Jade.

Difficult to make any comment about your friend's green dragon. But the last two posted are fake; first of them has wrong general shape and a machine drilled hole, jade type and baojiang are wrong too. The last one also shows fake baojiang and wrong jade type.

Regards (Pipane)"

Whooops!

Bill,.... any comments?


Cheers
Gman

This dealer is in China and selling counterfeit artefacts of antiquity. Selling fakes as authentics in China is legal.

Let's this dealer come out and I will show him why.

Have fun
Anita Mui

Hi Anita,
Haha...
Which one, the bait or the switch or both?

Sounds like a good reason not to have these kinds of games being played here.

Cheers!
Gman

Hi, Anita:

Check for the new message I just posted here:

http://www.asianart.com/phpforum/subforum.php?method=detailAll&Id=27752&sfid=4

Bill

Your name is Steven R. now Bill?

Thanks Bill.

Paipane and Steven have the same ip.

This webboard became fakers' private play ground.

Pls beware of forgery and fraud info.

Not fun anymore.

Anita Mui

And Bill "Jadelover" and B "Yu" both use Bellsouth, a southeast US regional provder. I wonder which might be Penumbra2001 from VA?

So if everybody uses the same provider must be the same person?

Good logic, I wonder if GMAN, Kevin Martin and Aimee are the same person since they all use RoadRunner?

Have you ever heard about programs that can mask one's IP adresses?

I guess there are a lot to learn about computer.

B

P.S. Are you really Mary since there are a lot of people using Gateway service. Now I wonder if the moderator would allow this message since they allowed yours.

Dear Steven R., Pipane, Riveria Stephane or whatever your name is:

I am puzzled with what kind of scam you are trying to pull and why you are such a coward. Since you are the one who used two different alibas, Pipane and Steven R. in this forum with the same IP address. You also posted similar messages at the Yahoo Hongshan group using the name Riveria Stephane to promote your "Hongshan items" at your Pipane site and that is why I know the name, Riveria Stephane, used by you there.

Are you so stupid or coward now you are claiming that I am now you and you are me? Please expalin what the heck do you mean with this message?

Please see the following message I wrote you and was ignored by you. I guess I must have written a message to apologize to myself if I am indeed Steven R.

Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2007 20:57:17 -0700 (PDT)
From:
Subject: Apology
To: pipane@doramail.com

Hi, Riviere Stephane:

I must apologize for posting your piece at the Asian Arts Forum without your prior consent.

....................

I am grateful for your graciousness in your message in not giving me a hard time.

Since you seem to be quite knowledgeable, it would be extrememly educational if you would pick a certain piece from your web site and let everybody comment on it or allow you to explain why it is indeed a real piece.

Everybody seems to have a different method in identifying a real Hongshan piece. Sometimes I find them very confusing.

Would you be willing to share the ways you use in identifying a real Hongshan piece. Are these pieces owned by you and are you a collector yourself?

Thanks.

Bill


You know, thank you for your messages. Now I finally figure out what the game is, by forcing all the competition out in this forum and by claiming everything Hongshan that are for sales everywhere are "fakes", you are probably working with all these other "mob" members, and now is time for you to act like a "Hongshan" expert and start promoting your fake jades here. What a clever scam, no wonder all the other dealers are working so diligent and agressive in killing off all opposite opinions. I wonder how much commission they are paying you to sell their "Hongshan" jades, I wonder.

Why can you not even disclose your true identity?

Bill

Quote jadelover8888:

"You know, thank you for your messages. Now I finally figure out what the game is, by forcing all the competition out in this forum and by claiming everything Hongshan that are for sales everywhere are "fakes", you are probably working with all these other "mob" members, and now is time for you to act like a "Hongshan" expert and start promoting your fake jades here. What a clever scam, no wonder all the other dealers are working so diligent and agressive in killing off all opposite opinions. I wonder how much commission they are paying you to sell their "Hongshan" jades, I wonder.
Why can you not even disclose your true identity?
Bill"

Bill, why are you so violently attacking this guy who's photos you posted into at least two of your threads?
(That we know of,... shall we start looking around for the reason why he asked if you are Steven R.?)

And are you sure you want him to disclose the reason why he posted under two different emails?

And when he posted to the threads where you put his photos up without crediting where you got them, he identified himself as a dealer.
You now have the nerve to say he is here on behalf of "all these other "mob" members,".

It is notable that you have finally slipped up and in your own words:
"You know, thank you for your messages. Now I finally figure out what the game is, by forcing all THE COMPETITION out in this forum"

First you post his photos from his website in your threads without credit, along with your friend's carved rocks, and now when he comes here to say he disagrees with your theories and that your friend's rocks are fakes he is now your "Competition" and an agent of the mob?

Anyone can go to his website (now that they know about it since you never identified it), and make up their own minds, but we still have not seen the pieces you and your partner B deem as authentic.

Bill,
I say this in all sincerity...you are losing it, and making a deeper and deeper hole for yourself.
Let it go Bill.

Gman

Dear Mr. Steven R. or whoever you are:

Would you please let us know what your real identiy is?

Steven R., Pipan or Riviere Stephane? or GMAN?

and which forum dealer/members you are working with? GMAN? or ?

(see below)

Subject:Who are you?
Posted By: Bill Fri, Oct 19, 2007 IP: 74.226.112.226
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Hi, Steven R. or whoever you may be:

I was curious when I saw your message here with such name because I remember the person from the
http://www.pipane.com/ who had just posted two messages in the forum thanking me for posting his piece from his dealer's site without agreement. I sent you an email to apologize earlier yesterday but never received any reply from you. I also remember seeing your message representing Pipane in the Yahoo Hongshan group in which you were promoting your items and the name you used there is Riviere Stephane. I went and check the other two messages posted by somebody named "Pipane" at the forum and I indeed found the IP address from both messages identical to the one posted here (see below):


Subject:Hong Shan Jades
Posted By: Steven R. Thu, Oct 18, 2007 IP: 222.130.205.227

http://www.asianart.com/phpforum/index.php?method=detail&Id=27756
Re: Examples of Bao Jiang
Posted By: Pipane
Posted Date: Oct 18, 2007 (11:34 AM) IP: 222.130.205.227

http://www.asianart.com/phpforum/index.php?method=detail&Id=27757
Re: The ebay jade plague
Posted By: Pipane
Posted Date: Oct 18, 2007 (11:48 AM) IP: 222.130.205.227

I am curious of the timing in your posting this message here with the pictures two "Hongshan" jade rings which were supposedly purchased from a dealer while you had recently presented yourself as both a jade dealer and a Hongshan jade expert in the Yahoo Hongshan group.

I consider both Randy and Anita my jade pals and I believe it is important for them to know who you are before they render their opinions. I believe you may have very good reasons for having two identities here and I am respectfully awaiting your reply. No disrespect intended.

Bill

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