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Subject:Orange Peel effect- Nephrite carving 3- glittering spots?
Posted By: Cordelia Tue, Dec 13, 2016 IP: 2a02:0c7d:201d:a700:

Oh forgot to say- I was a bit surprised to notice a few glittering spots on the belly of the carving which I can't seem to polish away...not sure if they show up well on the photo... I've not read about this before- anybody know anything about it?



Subject:Re: Orange Peel effect- Nephrite carving 3- glittering spots?
Posted By: Ernest Wilhelm Wed, Dec 14, 2016

Indeed. . . chatoyancy. I had a BC Jade (Nephrite) which had
chatoyancy.
Ernest

Subject:Re: Orange Peel effect- Nephrite carving 3- glittering spots?
Posted By: Cordelia Thu, Dec 15, 2016

Thanks for your reply Ernest...I wonder if you could explain a bit more about this? Is it a common thing as I've never heard of it before? Many thanks

Subject:Re: Orange Peel effect- Nephrite carving 3- glittering spots?
Posted By: Ernest Wilhelm Fri, Dec 16, 2016

It is not common. check Google under chatoyancy.
Ernest

Subject:Re: Orange Peel effect- Nephrite carving 3- glittering spots?
Posted By: Cordelia Fri, Dec 16, 2016

Following your reply Ernest, I have now searched the site on the word "glitter" and to my surprise I have found much interesting discussion about its presence in nephrite....

I have pasted in part of a comment from Bill below...


".. The collector asked other jade collectors in China to post pictures of jades that have this type of gold or silver specks and he got quite a few responses. 

A few jade collectors beleived this type of metallic spots could only be found on jades that were at least 2000 years old or before Han dynasty. One believes it happens mostly to jades that were buried in wet soil and will not affect jades buried in dry soils. One mentions that Mr. Chow Nam-Chuen, a very famous Chinese jade expert believes in this type of metallic specks is caused by contact between the jades and other metallic subjects. If this is true, then it will not be limited to ancient archaic jades. 

There do not seem to a concrete conclusion in the length of time for this phenomenon of metallic specks appearing on jade surface to occur. However, almost every single collector posted the pictures that agree if a piece of jade display this type of gold or silver specks, then their chance of being old is almost 90% sure." 

I had assumed the orange peel texture on my jade was careful sandblasting....you've seen my other pictures. ..do you feel there's any real chance of it being a genuine old piece?

My glitter is silver not gold by the way....

I'd love to know what period the style is too....It looks similar to some Han pieces to me but as you will see I'm certainly no expert....can you help?

Really appreciate your assistance !

Many thanks



Subject:Re: Orange Peel effect- Nephrite carving 3- glittering spots?
Posted By: richard Sat, Dec 17, 2016

I had a similar item and also noticed this glitter inside the carving and was hoping this carving was also very old.
This item was discussed on this forum some time last year.
I was told this horse shape was not known and probably made for the tourist trade? Still a nice item and very well "carved".





Subject:Re: Orange Peel effect- Nephrite carving 3- glittering spots?
Posted By: Ernest Wilhelm Sat, Dec 17, 2016

I checked some Jade carvings, which had what seemed to be golden flecks embedded. Now, pictures do not help much, and I could only advise you better if you would live close to Vancouver BC. Canada.
Or if you would make a trip to this region, Anything else is just guess work.
Regards
Ernest
[email protected]

Subject:Re: Orange Peel effect- Nephrite carving 3- glittering spots?
Posted By: Cordelia Mon, Dec 19, 2016

Thanks so much Ernest and Richard for your kind replies. I actually live in England Ernest so sadly I do not think I will be visiting your beautiful country anytime soon.

Richard that's a beautiful horse and certainly looks the part to me. If it really is a modern reproduction it just proves how clever these " fakers" are.

I really did not expect my jade to be an old one. But again it's certainly very convincing. I have now sent photos to " Value my Stuff" to see what their Chinese Art expert thinks about it. I'm not building my hopes up but I suppose there is always the tiniest chance it might be genuine.... Perhaps if he thinks there's any chance it's genuine he might be able to suggest somewhere in the UK to take it to an expert like yourself Ernest....

I really do appreciate your replies and advice gentlemen... Thanks again!

Subject:Re: Orange Peel effect- Nephrite carving 3- glittering spots?
Posted By: richard Sun, Dec 18, 2016

http://big5.ce.cn/kjwh/scpm/scxx/200704/13/t20070413_11026929_3.shtml

In this article, page 4, the author talks about the current condition of Hongshan jade markets with predominate fakes and thus affect the confidence of many Hongshan collectors. Therefore, he want to give some tips in authenticating Hongshan jades. In the second paragraph of this page, this is what he says,

"Metal Marks & Patches (I will use Metal Spots and Streaks)

The topic regarding metal streaks and spots have not been discussing in any jade books I have read so far. Nobody has talked about it. Of course, such topics as "Ding Gum Chum" (Nail Gold Diffusion} or "Sha Gum Chum" (Sprinkle Gold Diffusion) have been discussed in many books and they all believe they are due to the chemical reactions between buried jades with the acidic iron elements and acidic zinc elements in the soil. I do not think this is correct. This type of metallic streaks and spots, has to be caused by the inner metallic ions found inside the jade piece, after long burial in the ground and suffereing extreme heat, pressure and other oustide factors, the metallic ions will migrate toward the jade surface and concentrate there. Therefore this phenomenon is not due to outside contact with any types of metals. This phenomenon seems to happen more frequently with deep green and dark green actinolite (probably ferro-actinolie; this is the nephrite that has more iron in their structure) which contain more metallic iron. This seldom happens with white nephrite or Hetian jades (white nephrite is basically tremolite and has more Mg and very small amount of iron). This type of metallic spots and streaks is not limited to Hongshan jades but will appear on archaic dark green jades that are one thousands years or older. Therefore such special charcterisitic will be an extremely useful tool in authenticating archaic jades."

Subject:Re: Orange Peel effect- Nephrite carving 3- glittering spots?
Posted By: Cordelia Mon, Dec 19, 2016

Don't know if you saw my photos on my other posts Richard.... Here are a few more. Such convincing ageing!







Subject:Re: Orange Peel effect- Nephrite carving 3- glittering spots?
Posted By: pipane Wed, Dec 21, 2016

OMG!

Not antique, not nephrite, not jade.

I would save the trip to Vancouver if I were you.

Subject:Re: Orange Peel effect- Nephrite carving 3- glittering spots?
Posted By: Cordelia Sat, Dec 24, 2016

Thanks for your comments Pipane. The former director of Oriental Art at Spink and Son does not share your opinion however.

Subject:Re: Orange Peel effect- Nephrite carving 3- glittering spots?
Posted By: pipane Tue, Feb 07, 2017

I tried to post several answers but couldn't pass the moderator censorship... Too much sarcasm I guess. My bad.

Really? The director blabla? I doubt it very much or that person don't know anything about archaic jades. Too bad he didn't offer to acquire it!

Nevertheless let's try another approach to make my point clear : give me one/two weeks I can find similar jades right here, these are common fakes seen on the market... Archaic jade don't age like this : that simple. Period.

Regards.
P.


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