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Subject:Kangxi underglaze blue and pinkish red design
Posted By: Minto Mon, Aug 29, 2005 Hello netters, |
Subject:Kangxi underglaze blue and pinkish red design
Posted By: Anthony M. Lee Mon, Aug 29, 2005 My general feeling on this is that it is not correct though copied off a stylistically correct original with soem differences. The Kangxi original would likely not have been underglaze copper red and blue, but rather overglaze iron red, as well, this is an export style dish pattern on a Chinese domestic style plate, too heavily potted and large for the looks of it. I am also not happy with the right edge of the pomegranate which is cut off under the circling border. I think this may be evidence of a print, though I cannot confirm from the image. |
Subject:Re: Kangxi underglaze blue and pinkish red design
Posted By: Minto Wed, Aug 31, 2005 Mr. Lee, |
Subject:Re: Kangxi underglaze blue and pinkish red design
Posted By: keith jennings Mon, Aug 29, 2005 The rings around the mark look printed too, there are no start or stop points. keith |
Subject:Re: Re: Kangxi underglaze blue and pinkish red design
Posted By: Minto Wed, Aug 31, 2005 Hello Keith, |
Subject:Re: Re: Re: Kangxi underglaze blue and pinkish red design
Posted By: Minto Wed, Aug 31, 2005 Please see also Yongzheng mark. |
Subject:Re: Re: Re: Re: Kangxi underglaze blue and pinkish red design
Posted By: Aminuddin Sat, Sep 03, 2005 Hello Minto, |
Subject:Re: Re: Re: Re: Kangxi underglaze blue and pinkish red design
Posted By: PyroManiac Sat, Sep 03, 2005 Using a modern made mark as reference to prove that another modern made mark is not modern is ... kinda dumb in my opinion. All hand painted circles have a start and end point and an area where the strokes overlap causing a slightly darker section. Sometimes quite pronounced, sometimes just barely visible. The circles in your examples do not have it cause they (the mark) were made by modern printing method. Also if this was Kangxi as the dish is supposed to be, then why is the exposed clay of the foot rim that color? That's not Kangxi clay. That's something very different. This dish seems to be trying to pass itself of as an imperial version of a Chinese export item. But at least it's a very nice dish. |
Subject:Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Kangxi underglaze blue and pinkish red design
Posted By: Aminuddin Sat, Sep 03, 2005 My opinion is dumb, but myself is not. Minto has tried to attach another official mark, where all circles can't be seen a start and end point area. Many modern and fake circle lines have a start and end point stroke!. In Jingdezhen, the circle lines are painted using compass for drawing lines, not only using hand itself! It can be used just one turning or more. For the detailed reign mark, you must read further the book referring the official mark painting, by Prof. Liu Liang-yu. All hand painted circles have a start and end point and an area where the strokes overlap causing a slightly darker section is... kind a dumb in my opinion. |
Subject:Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Kangxi underglaze blue and pinkish red design
Posted By: Minto Sun, Sep 04, 2005 Thanks Amin, this sound is more reliable and logic opinion. Many of fine drawing dish are presumed as a print transfer as its beauty. Many of imperial reign mark dish is presumed for only imperial use, whereas many were exported in Europe and for domestic. |
Subject:Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Kangxi underglaze blue and pinkish red design
Posted By: PyroManiac Sun, Sep 04, 2005 Only a fool would say that such a underglaze circle was drawn using free hand method. I didn't say that did I? Take a compass. Draw a circle. See a start and end point? Do you see a start and end point on these circles? If you still can't or wouldn't, then there's nothing I can do to help you on this anymore. You also do not know what good quality Kangxi clay should look like? |
Subject:Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Kangxi underglaze blue and pinkish red design
Posted By: Aminuddin Sun, Sep 04, 2005 You pretend to be expert here, when perceiving several posting. In some cases, your arguments based on your poor judgment, whereas, you are apparantly not expert. In this case you always avoid what other reasonable arguments on images provided, by blaming others. You assumed this dish was posted by me? It is a dull-witted idea! I have seen many contributors here are polite and have reasonable opinion and reference books. I am sure they will be pleased when the pieces presented here are evaluated and strengthened with scholars references. |
Subject:Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Kangxi underglaze blue and pinkish red design
Posted By: keith jennings Sun, Sep 04, 2005 Boy, PyroManiac must of hit the nail on the head or his post would not have evoked such a strong response. Good job PyroManiac! keith |
Subject:Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Kangxi underglaze blue and pinkish red design
Posted By: Minto Sun, Sep 04, 2005 Amin, I keep nailing my colours to the mast on your opinion. Many of people don't have a leg to stand on. |
Subject:Re: Kangxi underglaze blue and pinkish red design
Posted By: Anthony M. Lee Sun, Sep 04, 2005 Minto and Amin, |
Subject:Response re marked export wares
Posted By: Anthony M. Lee Sun, Sep 04, 2005 Durning the Ming period, many export wares were marked as during the Transitional period up to the Kangxi period. However, they were not marked withthe double ring of an imperial guanyao (court ceramics) and in this script as shown in the various examples above. Usually the mark was six characters during the Kangxi period in three rows horizontally DAQING KANGXI NIANZHI or vertical three rows, but of a previous reign, e.g. Ming Chenghua or Xuande marks. In the 19th century Kangxi export style blue nad whites were normally marked KANXI NIANZHI two lines of two characters. I enclose a 19th century example from a garniture beaker vase. Though imperial marks , these are not to be confused with ceramics destined for court usage. |
Subject:Re: Response re marked export wares
Posted By: Amin Sun, Sep 04, 2005 Thanks Pak Lee, |
Subject:Re: Response re marked export wares
Posted By: Anthony M. Lee Sun, Sep 04, 2005 Yes, I agree, design first over reign marks, but reign marks are not enough to qualify a piece. The piece you show, I would not accept as being correct for the period either and the mark poorly executed in my opinion. The bowl is heavily painted and not at all calligraphic or tastefully done. Yes, design first and design wise this duck plate just does not say to me early 18th century. |
Subject:Re: Re: Response re marked export wares
Posted By: Phil Mon, Sep 05, 2005 Dear Minto & all, |
Subject:Re: Re: Response re marked export wares
Posted By: Amin Mon, Sep 05, 2005 I am socked with your third piece you showed that you confirmed it as Kangxi period. The piece you show, I would not accept as being correct for the period either and the artemisia leaf mark poorly executed in my opinion, though you mentioned your dish was made by private kiln in 18th century. The dish is pale painted though blue wash applied, but all mark or tastefully done are correct. See the design and artemisia leaf are painted in a haste, the blue is not shown delicately graded washes of blue that give a most pleasing effect. Again, the body of your dish is not great precision, where it was unusual in Kangxi wares. Eventhough, it has graded washes of blue, but it survived in 19th century to 1920s. |
Subject:Re: Re: Re: Response re marked export wares
Posted By: Amin Mon, Sep 05, 2005 Please also find attached a detailed polychrome and underglazed blue ware painted in refined blue, dated 19th century. Compare it with your first first you confirmed as Kangxi period. |
Subject:Re: Re: Re: Response re marked export wares
Posted By: PyroManiac Mon, Sep 05, 2005 Phil quite clearly stated that the mark is a conch shell and not an artemisia leaf which is also pretty darn clear from his image of the bottom of the dish. The dish that Phil illustrated is from a private kiln and because of that the quality of the Kangxi "fantasy" marks vary greatly even on a similar subject. Of course there are many different type of fantasy marks as well not just a conch shell which I also know for a fact is not an artemisia leaf . |
Subject:Re: Re: Re: Re: Response re marked export wares
Posted By: Amin Mon, Sep 05, 2005 Sorry, I am encountering and discussing with Mr. Lee, probably I am wrong to press a reply button. |
Subject:Re: Re: Response re marked export wares
Posted By: Amin Mon, Sep 05, 2005 Mr. Lee, sorry I am wrong to post a reply to other. I just replied your message in countering your opinion. Please find my below argument: |
Subject:Re: Response re marked export wares
Posted By: roy weatherford Tue, Nov 07, 2017 Here is a bottle neck?vase believe to be Kangxi period doubled blue circles,5 period colors,i'll take better full vase pictures,any help is it Kangxi?? |
Subject:Re: Response re marked export wares
Posted By: JLim Thu, Nov 09, 2017
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Subject:Re: Response re marked export wares
Posted By: Roy Fri, Nov 10, 2017 LOOK CLOSER ITS NOT A PINK PEACH ITS A VASE ON A STAND the peach is yellow |
Subject:Re: Response re marked export wares
Posted By: Roy Fri, Nov 10, 2017 The color is yellow and purple kangix period only had 5 colors purple was one check CHRISTIE'S AUCTION SITE ON CHINESE GLAZES DO YOUR HOMEWORK |
Subject:Re: Re: Response re marked export wares-2 duck plts
Posted By: Kang Wed, Sep 21, 2005 Only posted a couple of times long time ago. Enjoy reading the posts. |
Subject:Re: Response re marked export wares-2 duck plts
Posted By: roy Thu, Nov 09, 2017 anyone help with this vase-period it is 3 piece luted,peppered with rust spots trying to date this KANGXI????? |
Subject:Re: Response re marked export wares-2 duck plts
Posted By: JLim Mon, Nov 13, 2017
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Subject:Re: Response re marked export wares-2 duck plts
Posted By: plasticman Wed, Nov 15, 2017 I will just add my 2 cents to the list. In my opinion, the plate is modern work trying hard to be Kangxi. I have several pieces of period Kangxi porcelain and every one looks like the tankard in color of enamels and general condition. Kangs remarks mirror my experience. First look at the enamel work, the condition,(especially of the rims)and last at any marks. All of these criteria point to a modern product. |
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