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Dear friends,

I posted a message 2 days ago. Since it has still not appeared in the message board, I assume I must have made some errors, resulting in the message not being received by the moderator. Here is the
message again.

I discovered a piece of porcelain in my grandma's
trunk.

Its dimensions are
height= 21cm
width of mouth = 11cm
width of base = 7.5cm

There are 2 chinese characters in the
base

I seek your opinion on
- what does this porcelain represent. Is it a vase?
- is it a ru ware?
- is it an authentic piece?

Thank you.

From low-resolution photos hard to say about glaze, could be jun-type.

Ruyao never have mark unless inscribed poem by later-owning emperor.

Form look like modern florist or decorative ware. Inside-out seal mark (characters no color, so inscribed in seal instead of seal cut away so characters in low relief) signal 20th century.

Why do you call it porcelain?

Good luck,
Cal

Thanks for your response.

I agree with you that the picture quality is
poor. The original photo was taken with a
Canon 300D DSLR camera with 6 mega pixel. However
this picture takes up more than 1Mb and is not
downloadable on the site. The picture posted is a
watered down version. If you are agreeable I
am willing to email the original photo to you.

I noted that you have not commented on the
two characters. Any idea what is it?

The artifact is not made of metal, wood, stone,
glass, plastic nor any other synthetic material
that I can think of. Since it is made of clay
with a glaze coating, I presume it must be
porcelain. If it is not porcelain, what do you
suggest it to be.

Thanks.

You say "Since it is made of clay with a glaze coating, I presume it must be porcelain. If it is not porcelain, what do you suggest it to be."

There are many kinds of ceramic (clay or clay-like substances, fired in a kiln to some degree of hardness or vitrification) that may or may not be glazed (in several types of ways).

Porcelain is a compound of kaolin and a 'clay' composed of weathered granite particles. When fired to a high enough temperature in the right kiln conditions the result is a translucent white, waterproof product. In the West it came to be called 'hard paste' porcelain to distinguish from other ceramics composed of other materials and combinations of materials (such quartz and other siliceous materials, bone ash), made by potters in England, France and USA in 18 and 19 century.

In the West more distinction is made between 'stoneware' (not translucent, made of differing materials from porcelain, though very often white in color after firing) and porcelain, than is made in Chinese terminology. Some ceramics hard to define as one or another, such as Ding ware, which is often translucent to very strong light, yet is not made of same combination materials as porcelain.

Many types ceramics, stoneware, earthenware (fired lower temperatures, not as hard, not water proof) made in world including China in past and present.

Some experts believe there are about 26 examples of true Ruyao in world today, others think maybe 100 or so. This ware with beautiful blue-green glaze imitated countless times and ways in past 1000 years. Many collectors want to own genuine one, classification can be influenced by one's desire.

Web site of Shanghai Museum show example. Are many articles about Ruyao, do web search.

Book by Wang Qing-zheng, Fan Dong-qing and Zhou Li-li, /The Discovery of Ru Kiln/ (1991) give good survey of known shapes, glaze, types crackle.

Factors my opinion include your piece's shape and that where stilts were in firing is orange color not white. Your photos too poor to say if possible to classify your vase as what-is. Many modern ceramics cannot be classified as ancient type of ceramic since ingredients of ware and glaze different from ancient times.

Good luck,
Cal

Hi Cal,

I guess we both understand what is porcelain.

What I am interested in is ru ware. I accept that the number of ru wares are small. The exact figure is probably more than a hunderd, when the pieces that were excavated from the QingLiang temple kiln are included. Therefore
the chance of my piece being authentic is small. That is why I am writing to the message board for members' opinion. But then how many pieces
are there still waiting to be discovered? pieces in the possession of the
ignorant and pieces under the ground.

I fully agree with you the best way to learn is to read and see actual pieces in Museums. I am trying to get the book you recommended. Meanwhile can you recommend any internet sites with serious materials on ru wares?

Bye.

Even with excellent photos can be hard to identify exact nature of item. I not aware of web site that would help you, web sites all pictures and who knows source or authenticity.

Your photos poor. If you want actual identification need take to expert for personal handling especially place you can compare with genuine. Shanghai Museum, where may be able get in touch honorable Mr. Wang Qingzhen. National Palace Museum Taiwan (be aware that many items on display are reproductions for purpose keep safe actual ones). Sir Percival David Foundation London (ceramics recently moved).

If not want authentic evaluation, can dream. Dreams not all bad.

Good luck,
Cal

Hi Janice,

Your porcelain piece looks like a vase to me.

It has the following features consistent with ru wares
the sky blue color
the glaze covering the whole vase including the
base
the crackled appearance
the sesame seed on the base
the simple design
the glaze is not as good, though this may be
due to poor photograpy.

The two characters in the base read 'Fenghua'

Inscriptions in the base of ru ware are well
described. This is not the same as the poem
associated with the Emperor Qianlong. These
inscriptions refers to different places in the
Imperial Palace and parks around the Palace.
Fenghua refers to Fenghua Hall which is the
residence of the favourite concubine of Emperor
Gaozong. For more information on such inscriptions refer to an article by Regina Krahl at this site
http://www.sothebys.com/app/live/lot/LotDetail.jsp?lot_id=159433932

To see pictures of similar inscriptions go to these sites
http://photo.blog.sina.com.cn/blogpic/442b213d0100a0dy/442b213dt52a96e7e05f6

http://photo.blog.sina.com.cn/blogpic/442b213d0100a0dy/442b213dt5299ae136aec

Is this 'ru ware' authentic. I think so.
However, I would like to have the opinion of other
members.


Good luck

Hi Janice,

Noticed this "flower vase" when browsing through the net. This modern shape vase is not so "modern" as it do exist in olden Song period,too.

Refer link: http://www.xuancaoyuan.com/GuanYao/Qing/QianLong/YvZhiShi/FeiBenChao/SongGuan/index.html

However, unable to tell what the caption indicated as it was in Chinese.

By the way, when I minimized your photo to 50% view, I noticed a very good glazed texture on your vase. Maybe other members would try and comment on that?

IMO undocumented do not equate to non-existence

Thank you.
GT SAw

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