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Take a look at this jar I saw on ebay this week. While I was carefully examining the photos to this auction the seller ended the auction and sold it to the only bidder. I am curious what the forum thinks of its authenticity. I have decided that a lot about it looks very good and my intuition says it's OK but I have seen some extraordinary fakes as I'm sure you all have. If it is good I think it is a great piece of Yuan Dynasty ware but is it in fact too good to be true?

Fake for sure AND too good to be true...Yuan Qing hua on Ebay? that would be something...



regards,

Pipane

No doubt its a fake. Yuan items are extremely rare, and if it's really a "yuan" item, it would be worth tens and thousands of dollars.

I do not it is really ture of fake, but could you please explain in more detail why it is a fake iterm, except price discussion? Please show your knowledge about Yuan Blue & White for us. Thanks for your reply for teaching us.

"this is a very good replica. A dealer with so much knowledge about the piece is not a good sign. If he was sure it was genuine he would have brought it to a Christies or Sothebys and sold it for a hundred times more. Most dealers and collectors of high end items work closely or are in contact with specialists from auction houses and most of their items have been identified and valued for insurance and seen by specialist for future sale or research. The other point is that he gives no guarantee so if it is fake you can't return, so he is covering himself legally. He passes the responsibility to other specialist viewing the piece on the internet. With advance fakes these days the chances of it being genuine is very slim. Also the other things he got for sale is suspect."

Very well said. Need I say more?

Hi Brian,

I think the first thing the real expert like to see is the bottom of the vase. For me (as non expert) this looks old but my guess shouldn't be Yuan but Ming - Chenghua. Lets wait and see...

Regards,

Arjan

I would question the wave-forms around the neck, and some elements look more like late 17th century.

It is otherwise well painted and well fired, but any such piece should be examined personally before purchase: for major repairs/repainting, other damage, actual appearance, etc. Buying a fake or non-whole piece can be merely throwing away money since getting refund can be expensive and impossible. Even the auction site's promise via its payment-processing division is pretty empty since you must pay for expert appraisals to prove the fakery (the auction site is well known not to accept such appraisals as proof of fraud).

It may be against the auction-site's rules to stop an auction for sale to selected bidder unless it was a "buy it now" sale. You can complain to the site operator.

Thanks all for the responses. Be sure to take a look at the link I placed in another post for more and better images. The quality of the cobalt on this one seems to be a step up from the usual fakes. There is a noticeable presence of a granular (for lack of a better description) quality to the cobalt that was the result of inconsistent grinding during the Yuan period. It seems in period pieces you see tiny dots of darker blue present in the brush strokes that are the result of slightly larger granules of cobalt in the solution. In later wares this seems to have mostly disappeared and modern cobalt oxide is very consistent as a result of modern processes. Could it be that the craftsmen are now hand grinding their cobalt ore in order to mimic this effect? Also, take a look at the basin this seller is now listing. Another extraordinary object that also exhibits similar characteristics in the cobalt decoration. I don't recall seeing fakes before with this high quality of Yuan type cobalt. I know one must look at the entire object as a whole to make an assessment of originality but it was usually fairly easy to determine a fake or copy by the modern consistency of the cobalt. Has anyone seen this in the past? Also, the paste or clay body on this piece exhibits some areas where organic or mineral deposits have burned out in the firing leaving small pits or flaws on the surface. I have seen this on period pieces also but most modern wares seem to have a fairly clean and pure body.
On a side note, I am extremely pessimistic about finding anything of high quality and authenticity on internet auctions. That being said, I have personally bid on (mostly unsuccessfully) several items over the years that I have seen sell at major auction houses or from dealers for tens of thousands of dollars more than they sold for on the internet. I have not seen any Chinese ceramics that fit that category by the way and I certainly did not buy this jar. Nevertheless, it is extremely rare but it does happen occasionally. Anyway, here is the link again so you can all take a better look. Thanks.

http://cgi.ebay.com/A-YUAN-DYNASTY-SUMALI-BLUE-WHITE-JAR_W0QQitemZ250587595937QQcmdZViewItemQQptZAsian_Antiques?hash=item3a582f44a1

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