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Subject:Tang, Song or Ming Chinese Painting?
Posted By: Paul Fri, Jan 07, 2011 IP: 24.91.192.94

I own this very old Chinese painting for years. It is painting on silk of a scholar and two horses by the river, and landscape in the background. The painting is measured 21 1/2" x 27" framed, and 19" x 24 1/2" without frame. I've asked my Chinese friends about the writing in the back of the painting, and they adviced me that it is of old Chinese text, and they couldn't quite figure out what was written. Is it probably Tang, Song or Ming? I would love to know more about this painting's age and value.
Greatly appreciated in advance for your help!







Subject:Tang, Song or Ming Chinese Painting?
Posted By: rat Sat, Jan 08, 2011

hard to tell exactly. My first thought is Ming, but the colophon contains a dedicatory line at the end in a formula that I thought was only in use during the 19th century. Obviously the colophon could be a later addition but it's not clear to me why a later owner and not the painter would dedicate the painting to someone. Could be Qing, absolutely not Tang, and only a very small chance it's Song. The condition is not good and the composition quite basic. Despite what seems to be quite good execution of the figures and background trees, the elements don't flow together well. more detailed photos would help the assessment.

Subject:Tang, Song or Ming Chinese Painting?
Posted By: Paul Sun, Jan 09, 2011

Hello Rat,
Thank you very much for your expert assessment on the painting. Your analyis is excellent, and it puts some misteries to rest. Would you be kind enough to let me know what the writing is about? I've added more pictures of the back, and minor detail of the scholar. Hopefully, it'll be clearer.
Thanks again for your expertise on this subject.







Subject:Tang, Song or Ming Chinese Painting?
Posted By: rat Tue, Jan 11, 2011

sorry it's a bit too "grassy" (cursive) for me to make much out. there's litte documentary evidence there, no date, unless you can decipher the last four characters on the left and the seal, however the surname on the seal looks like it's missing due to damage to the paper.

Subject:Re: Tang, Song or Ming Chinese Painting?
Posted By: tom mclean Sat, Apr 05, 2014

Paul,

If still interested, The given name on the colophon seal is HeNian 鹤年. Artprice lists five with those given-name characters. Three have done calligraphy scrolls -- surnames Li, Ma and Lai.

Subject:Re: Tang, Song or Ming Chinese Painting?
Posted By: Paul Mon, Apr 07, 2014

Thanks Tom, much appreciated!

Subject:Tang, Song or Ming Chinese Painting?
Posted By: Paul Sun, Jan 09, 2011

Hello,
I've added a couple images from a watercolor series. I'd be really appreciated to have your assessment and valuation on these. My scanner did not capture the whole image, but it did not cut off the writing. The scanner also did not do justice of how beautiful they look in person.
Thanks again in advance for your expert opinion!
Sincerely yours,





Subject:Tang, Song or Ming Chinese Painting?
Posted By: rat Thu, Jan 13, 2011

Can't help much with these, except that the figures look non-Chinese to me in dress and accoutrements, and the way in which they are depicted also seems different from Chinese practices that I'm aware of. Perhaps they are illustrations of non-Han minority peoples in China. The first discusses a female official, the second I believe discusses some practices of the group pictured. Judging by the borders, these pages come from a printed book and are more likely woodblock prints than watercolors.

Subject:Re: Tang, Song or Ming Chinese Painting?
Posted By: Paul Thu, Jan 13, 2011

Thanks again to those who responded! Much appreciated!!!

Subject:Tang, Song or Ming Chinese Painting?
Posted By: por Thu, Jan 13, 2011

the horse doesnt looks the kind of horse from ancient china..it looks more mascular probably european..i would assume late 19th

Subject:Tang, Song or Ming Chinese Painting?
Posted By: rat Sun, Jan 16, 2011

yes, could be. see paul's other painting up for comment. the horse very closely following Castiglione's. the horses are well done, i wonder why the painter didn't make a living doing his own work rather than approximating earlier styles. perhaps there was more money in the market for "ancient" paintings.


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