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Greetings!

I hope someone will be able to tell me about this beautiful vase.

The vase is surrounded front and back with beautiful flowers, birds,etc. It seems very old. It has a mark but it's unclear because someone had at one time try to turn it into a lamp. There is also a Chinese character carving on it. I was told that typically the owner of the vase had carved their name on it.

Best Regards,

Tini



Thank you in advance,
Chris

Blue mark was apocryphal mark of Qianlong reign (1736-1795) of Qing Dynasty, China.

Very popular mark to put on items made first third 20th century and also late 20th century. Nothing like this made that reign.

Look like not more than 20-year old factory product.

Enjoy for decoration.

Good luck,
Cal

Thank you for your response!

Hi Chris

Ouch! Not only has it been drilled for a lamp but it would seem the neck has also been reduced.

The mark to the base would appear to be 'Qianlong' who was the Emperor between 1736-1795.

I would think this piece is probably of the period and whilst it's not in original condition I could still see it appealing to the mainland Chinese collectors.

The other marks are probably collectors or previous owners as you thought!

Best Wishes.

Gary

Hi Gary,

Thanks for your response!

Best Regards,

Tini

Your slip-painted vase with reduced upper rim was drilled through the middle of what I take to be an apocryphal 18th century mark of 'Made during the Qianlong Reign of the Great Qing Dynasty' (Da Qing Qianlong Nian Zhi). I've encountered similarly decorated porcelains attributed to the early 20th century. If the discoloration on the foot of yours is artificial, as it appears it might be, then the vase probably fits in this same period. However, the image isn't definitively clear as to this point.

The inscribed characters read from the top as 'Cai Dafu Gong', with Cai Dafu being a common personal name and 'Gong' a title meaning 'gentleman'.

Best regards,

Bill H.

Hi Bill,

Thank you for your response. I was wondering how could I determined if the discolouration is artificial? I am curious, I feel that the piece is genuine.

Thanks in advance,

Tini

Your vase is genuine, it just happens to have an apocryphal reign mark. If the stains diminish after scrubbing with a toothbrush using warm water and detergent, then I'd see a ray of hope of the vase being late 19th century. However, such porcelain decoration actually was fairly common as a response to the turn-of-the-century Art Nouveau Movement. As Cal also has mentioned, vases of this same form weren't around during the 18th century.

Best regards,

Bill H,

Hi Bill,

Thank you for you opinion on the vase.

I tried cleaning the vase as suggested. I was not able to clean all the stains. Please see photos. There is 3 charecter red mark stamp located just below the inside rim and it was unclear.

Best Regards,

Tini



Tha

Hi Chris.

You can see how different opinions can be on the same piece.

Whilst Cal and Bill both lean towards a 20th Century dating they are both seemingly at either ends of the dating spectrum!!

The problem with a 20th Century attribution for me is the colour of the mark...This blue does not appear to be a Republic shade nor a later 20th Century version.

Also note the foot rim! This colour would not be typical of a 20th Century date line!

The only doubt in my mind is the decoration which should be highlighted in blue which was common practice during the 18th Century on this sort of 'slip' decoration...

But the main question you have to ask yourself is why would someone go to the trouble of having their name etched into the base if at one time it was not regarded as an important piece to someone!

In my mind you need to have the mark carefully examined under close magnification and that will confirm it's pedigree without any doubt.

Regards,

Gary

Hi Gary,

Thank you for your recent comment. I agree on your comment about the etched name. I feel that the vase must have a significant value to the owner, otherwise why bother marking his name on the vase?

I will have the mark examined and hope to hear a good news!

Thanks for your assistance!

Best Regards,

Chris

Hello Gary,

I'd only remind about the question of form. Reviewing Liu Liang-yu's tome and several other references containing diagrams and/or illustrations of Qianlong-period porcelains produced no evidence of double-eared vases with necks that begin in a vertical collar such as this one. Neither were any 18th century or earlier examples of slip decoration with this sculptural complexity found. Most examples in my books seem to be either Batavia or Swatow wares with more simple motifs apparently just brushed on, and on a blue ground in the case of the Swatow piece seen.

Just to confuse the issue, I'll also note how this kind of Qianlong mark was being forged convincingly circa the late 19th century on a variety of Japanese wares. As can be seen with this unmarked Kutani vase of the late Victorian era, the Japanese seem to have been primed for the Art Nouveau market by that time. Not unexpected, I suppose, as they get credit in some quarters as providing inspiration for the movement.

Cheers,

Bill H.

Hi Bill

Well you could be right!

I still suspect that it's probably 19th myself as the decoration does appear later as I pointed out to Chris earlier.

Cal seems convinced it's a lot later but I could only be sure myself if I saw a close up, x30 or better of the mark.

I do have pictures of similar shaped pieces in a couple of mainland Chinese sale catalogues which seem to date this style to the 19th Century so who knows? They could be wrong! :-)

Best Wishes

Gary.

Concession may be premature.

When digging a bit deeper into the subject, one slip-decorated baluster vase surfaced that bears more than a passing resemblance to this one, vertical collar and all. It was sold by Christie a couple of years ago in London. Its base bears a Qianlong mark that was judged to be of the late part of that period.

Of note, the glaze color looks lighter than the apparent tone of this one, and the ears are formed somewhat differently. In my opinion, the marks compare well, at least to the extent that they can be seen. The Christie sale link is included below.

The review still seems to indicate that most slip-decorated Chinese porcelain in this style are 19th century or later. However, some of the slip-painted celadons I came across seem clearly to be on the forms of chinese vases, including those of baluster and gu shape, that were popular from the Daoguang period onward and served as platforms for such mass-produced wares as rose medallion.

And of course I suppose an auction house error can't be ruled out, but I'm sure they have a better reference library than I do.

Hopefully other views on this finding will be forthcoming.

Tini, don't give up the slip! :)

Best regards,

Bill H.

URL Title :SlipVase

Prior owner can make mistake, think 18th century.

Have seen this faded color bluish green common 1930s, then again last third 20th century florist ware. With the visible ware and glaze flaws, I think more likely later than earlier.

Good luck,
Cal

Looking through auctions and came across this at Christies Qianlong M & P

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