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Subject:Chinese cloisonné odd signature
Posted By: Lionel Sun, Apr 20, 2014 IP: 82.241.232.198
Hi,

I just inherited three chinese cloisonnes. They were bought as antics by my great grandfather in 1935, in an auction. He often said they could originated from the Ming dynasty.

The signature seal contains indeed the"great Ming" symbols, but the Ming character is written backwards (it is reversed, as if reading it from a mirror).

Does someones know if this is a writing mistake, revealing that the vases - or more probably only the seals - were imitated ? Or were there a period in the Chinese art during which the seals may have contained mirrored characters ? I know that there have been many trends in the seals writings combinaisons - as in the sense of writing for example.

Thanks for your help !

Lionel







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Subject:Re: Chinese cloisonné odd signature
Posted By: doug Mon, Apr 21, 2014
This piece is Japanese champleve from maybe the 1930s. The archaic script could mean something or just be assembled to make it look important. It is an inepensive export piece made for the western market for oriental looking things.

Cheers

Doug

Subject:Re: Chinese cloisonné odd signature
Posted By: Lionel Tue, Apr 22, 2014
Thank you, Doug. Can you tell me how you can spot that this was made in Japan and that it was inexpensive?

It was sold in 1935 as an antic, so if you think it was produced in the 1930s, it means it has been artificially aged to be sold in an auction?

Thank you!

Lionel

Subject:Re: Chinese cloisonné odd signature
Posted By: idcloisonne Thu, Apr 24, 2014
Sorry but your relative was duped. Doug is right, these are typical champleve pieces made in Japan for export.
The odd mark looks like it was added after production, I have seen this same mark recently applied in the same way on another large Japanese champleve jar with lid and foo dog finial.
How de we know? Because there are so many of these on the antique resale market, and some are signed 'MADE IN JAPAN' dating after 1921.
China was not very involved with champleve production or exports, they made a lot of cloisonne and enamel covered copper pieces or Canton enamel. (Cloisonne involves applied wires-partitions with enamel applications, not impressed or molded cavities filled with enamel as in champleve).

Subject:Re: Chinese cloisonné odd signature
Posted By: Lionel Fri, Apr 25, 2014
Thank you for your help. I don't know anything about cloisonnes or champleves, however I had doubts when looking at the signature. I asked a Japanese friend and she told me this kind of mistake can only have been made by a non Chinese/Japanese writer.

Thank you both for providing these infos and details on champeleve and cloisonne techniques, it's interesting.

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